See the entire conversation

Fuck Spotify, and fuck any “podcast” that’s only playable in one app.
489 replies and sub-replies as of Aug 08 2020

Whatever you do Marco don't say anything bad about Joe Rogan. I found out the hard way lol.
Better or worse than the Musk fans?
They're probably better than the Musk fans but still mostly intolerant of naysaying their icon.
Shut the fuck up
👆Can’t tell if being intentionally ironic
@czjwAFC Well played if so.
yeah i am aha I’m a fan of him but not gonna hate on people that done like him🤣🤟🏼
Pretty inclusive Venn diagram there.
I can say for certain that they dislike the term “Muskrat.”
Ohh that must have went over like a fart in church...
I think you mean Mr. Battery and Fr. Factor
They're the same wackos.
the venn diagram is basically a circle
And yet somehow also worse
Same energy they just get provoked by different reasons but attacking the boss will always trigger their very stupid fury.
Today I learned who Joe Rogan is 😬
must have lost his mind. Way to align with the Axis of Evil.
Having trouble figuring this out the logistics for this.
Three or four more "review mistakes" from Google and that'll pretty much be every podcast if you're an Android user.
What is a review mistake?
That is my podcast app. It works great!
See my tweet earlier at you this week. I'm currently using Spotify for NPR podcasts.
I hope they won't own the podcast space in the future. They're doing pretty well on that front. Open up your podcasts, don't let them have the monopoly
joe rogan on fewer platforms is a great thing. now if we can just get him off spotify too we're golden.
Because when you can't beat your enemy with valid points and sound arguments, it's easiest to silence them.
I have never listened to Joe Rogan, so I will not be missing him.
It’s not really about missing him, more about monopolies. Spotify can control the market, shut down your favorite podcast. As @marcoarment can attest to, Rss feeds are more open.
I do not agree. As long as independent podcasters exist and continue to make their content freely accessible to everyone, NO PERSON, ORGANIZATION, OR COMPANY will be able to control the podcasting market. THAT is how it is and how it will continue to be.
Tell us how you really feel. ☹️
It’s ok, it’s Joe Rogan. I’m glad I won’t stumble upon his videos on YouTube anymore.
Exactly, hopefully this gives rise a to a new popular podcast with half a brain
Not much you can do. Maybe ask podcast hosts to start every episode with “Fuck Spotify”? Example: “Fuck Spotify. So Casey, tell us about garage door hack 2.0.”
That wouldn’t be a podcast then, it would be an appcast.
I quite like the term "paidcast".
They’re still free. Just within someone else’s ecosystem that isn’t open.
"If you're not paying, you're the product." (See eg google, facebook etc.) Exclusivity is counter to the original podcast idea, so I like paidcast as a nice distinction.
We were already the product. Nothing changes but where you access the content.
Nah - if I want to listen to a podcast the old fashioned way (download it with an RSS reader and put it on my ipod/generic mp3 player), it's as open and free as you can imagine. Here, I either enrich techbros at spotify, or listen to ads for things I don't want. Paidcast.
I'm talking about the podcast in question. Have you listened to the JRE? It has ads. Same applies to many other non platform exclusives.
Yep. And spotify will wrap it on other ads, like they do with all the other shows that have ads. Don't want them twice.
I'm not defending Spotify, but they don't monetize podcasts. Podcast support is a loss leader for them.
S/o to the oldies who remember when YouTube had no ads. 😅
I enjoy people saying Spotify won't monetize podcasts, when they themselves are telling us how they intend to do it:
Rewriting the playbook for podcast advertising
(no description)
It's obvious that they didn't spend $100 million on a podcast to just give it away. They're not stupid.
Hadn’t seen this, thanks for sharing.
I didn't say they won't, I said they don't.
Fair point, I leaped ahead to the future.
Yes, they do. Either through ads, for free accounts, or as interesting content to keep people as subscribers.
Paid is wrong imo, a podcast can cost money and be open, eg. Gruber and Ben’s Dithered podcast
I call them paidcasts
This move will either hurt Rogan or hurt podcasting. Not a great move.
Or it will force his lessor fans to find new podcasts to listen to. It could be great for podcasts, I don't want or need Super Podcasts, just a lot of niche/sustainable podcasts
Yeah I hope you’re right
What in the complete fuck is a “sustainable” podcast? As opposed to all those carbon emitting non-renewable podcasts?
A sustainable podcast is one that is able to financially support its makers so that they are able to continue making it into the future.
this is a perfect example of someone getting really pissed off at something when they hear a bunch of buzzwords they don't like and not actually trying to understand what they mean
That’s an interesting perspective.
He is likely making a ton of money through spotify by doing this. You are wrong.
He's already making a ton of money on his podcast. I can't imagine they are paying enough to cover what he stands to lose.
This isn't a nice that will bring him more of an audience, only less. Why do that? I argue the main reason is you secure your money up front and so can care less about the quality of your show. You lose your hunger!
Yeah. I’m not too confident in this, personally. I have a feeling Spotify will want to have certain things censored and certain guests won’t be on anymore. Bad move.
i'm guessing it won't hurt him. why sign if it did? anyway, how will it hurt podcasting? won't it more open space up so others can follow in his successful footsteps? i hope he got paid much for signing. he deserves a payout considering the effort he's put into building his show.
The power of podcasting is its openness and ease of access. For example, new podcasts from Gimlet (which I’m sure are good) are no longer accessible to me because I am not a Spotify subscriber. Podcasts should not become Netflix.
spotify's content isn't hidden behind a paywall. folk who put content in spotify are still making it easy for you to access it. if you choose not to access content that is in spotify's library, you are the one making things hard on yourself. don't make things hard on yourself. ✌🏾
I should install Spotify if I want to listen to their podcasts? No deal. And yes maybe they aren’t currently behind a paywall, but some if not all of them will be at some point.
1) no, you do not need to install the app. you can use their web app: 2) don't let your fears of what might happen in the future become so great that you judge folk in the present because of them. (i am working on this myself)
Spotify is a digital music service that gives you access to millions of songs.
If I can't use the same app I use for all my podcasts for one outlier, the solution is simple: don't listen to the outlier. Saying that I can access it online without the app doesn't help, unless that online player has all the features of @OvercastFM, and is installed on my phone
Exactly. Currently most podcasts can be listened to on our app of choice; it’s an open protocol. Having to switch to a specific app (Spotify) to listen to 1 podcast when the rest are all being listened to in another is a frustrating experience. How is this good for end users?
a heads is only starting in September of this year that JRE will be available in my app of choice, spotify. i don't complain though since it is still out there free to access. because i enjoy JRE, i have chosen to listen to it using an app that was not of my choice. ✌🏾😉
what i am saying is, i don't listen to JRE because its in my app of choice. it isn't. what i am saying is, i listen to JRE because i enjoy listening to JRE. stop tripping. JRE will soon only be available in one app, true, but it will still be free to access. again, stop tripping.
Well said Dagem. While people might disagree with the decision, the intensity of the anger seems extreme. None of us are entitled to free content - it is a gift and if all we have to do to access it is use an app, that is very little friction.
thanks. one thing though, it is very unlikely that JRE could have become as popular as it has, monetizable as it has, without it having been offered for free. i get what you mean though and yeah, the intensity of folk's outrage does definitely seem extreme. ✌🏾
I think it’s less about listening in an app of choice and instead that Spotify is kind of breaking the podcast standard. If JRE decided to put up a paywall, there might be a backlash, but it would be for entirely different reasons.
while Spotify is an early adopter of the new unwritten podcast standard, i do not believe them to be the initial breakers of the old unwritten podcast standard. 🤪
The Times They Are A-Changin'
The Times They Are A-Changin', a song by Bob Dylan on Spotify
It’s that hard to switch apps?
It’s not switching. It’s adding another one.
so you're more a fan of the app you use than the shows featured in said app. this is your right, but then should you really be one to speak about the true value of podcasting & what can help it? valuing the platform over the content is to me something that can hurt podcasting. ✌🏾
Spotify is the antithesis of the podcasting universe, the Empire who tries to subvert the Senate. I will never download that shit app designed to pimp more ads and steal more data. Literally get fucked Sweden.
Sweden? The entire Sweden is to blame for this?
Ya but prior to Spotify you could literally have ALL your podcasts from EVERYONE in a single podcatcher app. That’s convenience. That’s what we like and want more of, not less of. Spotify takes it from being an open standard to a paywalled or ad-inserted proprietary piece of shit
Spotify is only available in 80 countries out of 195. RSS does not discriminate.
good point. this does limit access. i wonder if the deal takes this into account? he should be free to get his content into other libraries in countries spotify does not operate.
That wont change
The market, ergo business solutions, are expanding. You’ll see more “ideas” and fracture along lines of success. The OG podcasters and fandom can claim elite “first comment”. Why paint it in such bleak black and white tones?
This isn't about what's good for the show. Spotify offered Rogan 100 million dollars to be exclusive. Who wouldn't do that? Joe is looking after Joe like most people would. The show will still be there free if you want it.
Agreed. I’ll keep listening for the rest of the year, but I’m out after that.
Why are a million people forgetting that @HowardStern did the equivalent move 14 years ago when he signed with SiriusXM. It was a brilliant move for both Stern and the satellite radio provider.
Okay settle down there. He’s not the father of podcasting.
How doesn’t this benefit Rogan? If he can get that type of money then other podcasters will start looking that high instead of taking petty $$ for ads that ruin every podcast.
Who gives a shit. He's a scumbag.
If someone gave you 100 million. Are you gonna be hurting? My guess is no. All this will hurt is YouTube and help other content creators.
Why. It's great for podcasting Its shown people what they are actually worth to robbing platform like you tube and apple.
Rogan is set. If it doesn't work out hell just quit and retire.
Yup. This is terrible news for the future of free podcasts
Yep, just read the Joe Rogan announcement and that was enough for me to finally cancel my Spotify account.
Just curious, what is your reasoning behind this?
Fuck 10s of millions of dollars and promotional infrastructure to make JRE even bigger internationally
Amen. I hate that the big podcast apps don’t have a way to export your subscriptions as OPML. I had to dig deep in the guts of to get mine out of there.
That’s one of my dislikes about Stitcher - their stuff is only playable in their app, and it lacks features. 😕
Oh, I’ll have to have a look at that. Nice find, thanks. 👍🏻🙂
Works flawlessly. I am using this for True Crime Garage. But need to have the Stitcher Premium account
Cue the 'you just can't handle the competition' takes
Now there’s some good healthy competitive sportsmanship
People like him will regret moves like this when all the aggregators start locking down and taking more control. As always happens. I've been slowly moving myself off the silos because I see what's coming when the VC runs out and companies start chasing retreating margins.
He probably didn't want to get censored on YouTube and Spotify gave him a big wad of cash to do it. I don't like it but I can't blame him.
Also, you don't have to have a paid subscription on Spotify to listen to him so most that want to hear him will just sign up on the free tier and not think anything about it. :(
True But I am assuming there would be lots of advertisements while listening to a 3 hr podcast don’t have any subscription on Spotify
He already does a ton of pre-rolls
I've seen Spotify is paying $100,000,000. I would do it too!
Ad revenue on YouTube is pretty pitiful right now. Even if you manage to get your channel monetized, ads are often disabled on seemingly innocuous videos. There's no clear policy.
Would you say the same for any company that signs exclusive content deals - Netflix, ESPN, Sky Sports, HBO, Amazon Prime etc?
That's a totally different issue as movie streaming is not an open platform like podcasting where most people even host the podcasts themselves and it's built upon an open standard.
I think people are hung up on the term podcast. If you just call it a show, the exclusiveness isn't a big deal.
I think it's not so much about that, it's that Spotify and others are buying up successful podcasts and converting them into "shows" within their walled garden.
Exclusive content is king. Streaming, video games, app stores too.
It also kills industries though. Podcasting what about freedom and with each passing day that becomes less true.
Hah! Are you kidding? Exclusive content is king in USA and EU. We don't have such in Russia for example. 150 hundred mln. people and no Spotify as example. Legal limitations that we are tired of
Spotify is free to use, just like YouTube. What’s the problem here? He’s cashing in.
It is the idea of being tied up to one platform. What happens if later down the road after many users have switched to Spotify, the decide they no longer want to offer the free option. Spotify already doesn't allow downloads for free users. This isn't what podcasts are!
You mean like when @HowardStern went from terrestrial radio to the subscription-based satellite radio service SiriusXM?
Hi, can u share more color why podcast in Spotify is not open standard.?
Because "regular" podcasts consist of an RSS feed you can subscribe to in every Podcast client. Spotify is just like a music album on their service. You can't subscribe to shows from outside or using your own player like Apple Podcasts or Overcast.
But why would you be mad at a single person moving their podcast to a paid platform? It’s not like the whole podcast system is moving there. Are you mad that you can’t listen to Joe Rogan anymore without a Spotify? Because that’s the only logical reason I see.
You are right, it's all the same - exclusive content. it's just which game you want to play - subscriptions or advertising. I don't subscribe to most of the services listed above, and I rarely feel left out.
Yes. Podcasts just had a head start on the right track.
I would say that the analogy would be more like if a TV broadcast station only worked on, say, Samsung televisions.
Right? We’ve forgotten what “open” means.
I love Overcast, is the best podcast app (only available on iOs).
Rogan doesn’t have the same hurdles releasing his podcast in an open way @marcoarment would have making an Android app. I wish he’d make a Mac app or an Android app, but your analogy doesn’t hold up that well.
Exclusives occur in all industries. That it also happens in the world of podcasting means that we are on the right track.
That’s a better point. Your analogy still doesn’t really work. Content of this sort is basically easy to spread openly. Developing an app is a specific and (I hope!) a sustained effort.
Overcast in android is like asking joe rogan to do his podcast in japanese
It is the same, an exclusivity, for different reasons.
Apps have never been an open standard. The amount of effort required to build a great app is wild, now duplicate for all other OS. Podcast aggregation has an openness that apps never had, that’s the difference.
On the right track to ruin podcasting you mean? Podcasting used to be about freedom. Now we’re on the path to everything being owned by a handful of conglomerates like all other media.
Oh the freedom of podcasting....
Um, yes, the freedom of podcasting. The freedom of the open internet, free exchange of ideas...
It’s an app made by one person that accesses publicly available RSS feeds and allows people to export OPML (their entire library) to other apps should they decide to switch platforms. There is zero switching cost if you want to stop using Overcast. Not so with Spotify
Overcast didn’t magically create itself. Marco has to learn a completely different language to make the Android version, then he has to maintain two different code bases. I don’t blame him for choosing only iOS. Your comparison is apples and oranges.
It is the same, an exclusivity, for different reasons.
A esto le llamo yo un Zasca en toda regla. 😅
It’s not even remotely the same. Overcast has its own user experience, there are many other players out there that do the basic job. It doesn’t have its own content; just its own UX. if you want to listen to JRE next year, there’s only one player you can use.
Have you tried @CastroPodcasts? I’ve yet to find something as good as it.
Thanks for the kind words Brad <3
Well said, sir!
Pretty much stopped listening to LPOTL after they went Spotify exclusive.
Didn’t you and all of @atpfm say you’d do it for hypothetical boat loads of money? Iirc.
- what steps (if any) do you think Apple could or should do to maintain podcasting as an open ecosystem?
They need to make the Apple Podcasts app available on Android, like they do with Apple Music. They should also make sure it's a much more seamless experience than Spotify (actually compete). That might be asking too much.
Surprised? Everyone has a price.
Gotta admit, these are smart moves by Spotify
I fail to understand the outrage— your choice to remove Alex Jones (and yes, he is a crazy nutter who is a horrible human being) based on your desire to select who to promote is not so far removed from Rogans desire to control where he appears and what ecosystem he supports
Truer words have never been written.
As far as I know he’s using the Apple podcast database and you can add the feed manually if you’d like. Can’t do the same with Spotify exclusives.....
Marco removed it prior to apple, but point taken.…
I removed Infowars from Overcast’s search and recommendations earlier this week. Usually, I outsource content-filtering to Apple’s much larger staff, but in this case, I believe Apple has failed to de-list a podcast that violates its own guidelines:…
He’s got those soggy Twitter emotions.
I don’t see any outrage towards Rogan — he’s trying to run his show in the most profitable way. The outrage (which I share) is towards Spotify who are trying to take an existing open platform and co-opt it into one they own. Like Facebook did for news; we all know how that goes
YouTube inserts itself into the creative process by making content demands; Rogan saw the writing on the wall.
Youtube and their censorship is another reason Rogan wanted out as well. It's believed he wanted certain guests on to talk about Covid-19 and he was told youtube would take down the videos and or demonitize them. Why would he stay? Youtube needs him, not the other way around.
I am all for breaking up YouTubes control over video, but hesitate in celebrating the move of audio podcasts to a more controlled venue…
I don’t consider those podcasts. Those are more like network shows. I think it is fine for them to waste money on exclusive content.
It’s not a podcast if I can’t play it on my iPod!
What’s Spotify? 😉
Do you live on Mars?🧐
What a stupid question. Like really what is the point of your question, Spotify is not available in his country and now he won't be able to listen to his favorite podcasts which at that point are no longer podcast rather they are "shows"
It was obviously sarcasm at the shock that Spotify was not available somewhere on earth. So you can take your stupid question and bow your head in shame.
Exactly. Just making a lil joke because I thought Spotify was available worldwide. Forgot I was on the internet where people get butthurt.
😂 That's so awesome!
It's a big deal. There are a bunch of countries where Spotify isn't available.
Oh wow, didn't realise they werent heavily worldwide.
Same. Was shocked. Issue you can get with having all your eggs in one (proprietary) basket ... See Youtube/Internet penetration here, for ref.:
See Youtube coverage, for reference.
Yep, it’s just as bad as Disney+ launch or some other streaming services. There’s no legal way to pay them and most of the times they make it impossible.
Note how they’re almost entirely absent in Africa. Guess who is heavily present in Africa, though? (Hint: it’s fruity.)
I mean we were begging to have Spotify for years in Russia, there is each and every service, Apple Music, google anything else + local ones EXCEPT Spotify :D
Weird that you get apple but not Spotify.
I think musk would bring internet to mars before people :-)
TIME FOR OUR SPONSOR>>> EXPRESS VPN LMAO not a chance Spotify. Dig a hole.
You really don’t like Kevin Smith’s new club then. Anything after a certain age gets archived behind a paywall.
Except making money is becoming harder, platforms like YouTube are already censoring, so..what choice is there?
Get a proper job ;)
“Podcasts” published only on YouTube are literally the worst.
Big bucks are coming
I'm not a fan of this move, but how is this different than exclusive Netflix shows?
Podcasts are (still) an open format, TV shows have never been.
That said, the balkanisation of TV services sucks as well. I might not get all the cool kids’ shows with my cable subscription, but there’s more than enough good stuff, and I have no desire to pay five different companies to watch five different things.
Oh god I would much rather pay 5 different companies that I can turn on and off when I like than give a dime to comcast. Plus being almost completely commercial free is an incredibly nice perk.
No opinion on this, but how is this different than what Howard Stern did with Sirius XM?
No different, IMHO. Rogan will just be another show that I stop listening to. I would be more likely to support a podcast directly (which I already do), than to move to a platform like Spotify or Sirius XM.
Hence the critical need to "de-centralize" the web. Podcasts give the illusion of de-centralization, but when podcasters use a centralized platform like spotify, google, or itunes they are just begging to get shut down. And nobody cares, or will defend you.
The Joe Budden Podcast is the same way. Spotify exclusive for listening. YouTube 2 days later and it’s not the full podcast
fuck capitalism is what you're saying K bud
Just downloaded podcast addict after Google's BS
I literally downloaded Overcast yesterday, and after this news I’ll be switching from Spotify for all my podcasts. Really love what you’ve built!
I have only tried Spotify once several years ago. After that, I uninstalled it and have not tried it since. :)
There’s the Marco take I was looking for. 😗👌
Let off. Spotify pays artists. You can take them with you with a subscription. Without platforms like this you would be without music.
Spotify doesn’t pay jack. Take Route 80 or Route 10 and drive across country. You’d have at least 40% dead air.
So music didn’t exist before Spotify? 🤔
No, there would be no medium. You can't trust people with mp3s. Believe me, i was 0day on shit. And believe me this: There are still people using torrents and other ways to get their fill of pirated software and music.
I have a suspicion this is as much a move into video as it is continuing to cement their position in podcasting. I have a sneaking suspicion this is an opening salvo in a longer-term play against YouTube. Time will tell, but Spotify is diversifying at a scary rate.
I suspect you’ve hit nail on the head. This isn’t a Hail Mary but they’re swinging for fences out of the gate. (Sorry, four sports metaphors in row.) Others are mired in podcast vs. paidcast (and are pro/anti @joerogan from the jump) but this is a video play wearing a disguise.
Definitely. It’s going to be very interesting to see what their next move is. Not to say the Podcast vs. Paidcast discussion isn’t worth having, mind you.
I agree with the notion of podcasts being consumable via any app, but I’m sure Spotify could argue they are entitled to “exclusive” content, like Netflix or Hulu do with video.
Don’t beat around the bush, Marco. Say what you really think!
Marco so mad hahahaah😂😂😂😂 keep crying!
what is a spotify?
when any big company favors exclusivity over inclusivity they risk the Amazon/Facebook recoil, and they'll deserve it 😒
A podcast I used to enjoy moved from free to luminary with the free version changing to a 10 minute weekly ad for the luminary podcast. Deleted.
Facebook news feed all over again. 🙄
Spotify to labels: "It would be a shame if our users wouldn't find your artists' new releases" 😎
it's not a #podcast if it doesn't have a publicly available feed
spotcast - podcast available only via spotify
Scare quotes indeed...
Somebody had to say it. 😬
I really can’t understand this move. Money? He’s arguably the biggest podcast ever and sponsoring + YouTube revenue should be through the roof. He would be much more powerful staying independent and owning his media. Do you guess the reasons, except money, which isn’t really one?
- YouTube revenue is not a lot of money when you are comparing to 100m . - this deal is listed as exclusive distribution which is not ownership.
If he was to be independent & make money then he would need to make his own platform with his own ads to gain revenue. All of which will hurt his fan base & value.
Podcasts can’t be compared to music in terms of deals. Speaking of which , we have barely any details on the condition of this deal.
Probably more about censorship than money, or a little bit of both.
say it again king!
Why are you so angry about a person’s decision to manage their business? This is equivalent to Stern’s decision w/ Sirius.
I use @Spotify - but I will never use them for podcasts.
Because it is not Overcast. No smart-speed, no trim silence. All my other subscriptions to independent podcasts are in Overcast. Having them spread over multiple apps? – No, thanks. And let's not forget privacy: I don't want to be profiled by Spotify based upon my interests.
I won't use Spotify because exclusivity is a nail in the coffin of the open internet. I don't like paywalls and "podcasts" turning into satellite radio or having AM-radio-like commercial breaks every 11 minutes.
As far as I know, allowing podcasts to go exclusive to a platform will allow hosts to never have ads because they are now being paid directly via the platform. Good, no?
Picture when companies like Spotify corner the market on podcasts.We will be in the world of duopolies,where there will be no new feature development and audio quality degrades, and we get ads every 10 minutes like AM radio. I despise consolidation in an industry like podcasting
No. If gatekeepers become the norm, punters can’t choose any podcast, and new podcasts can get no audience. Things stultify. A podcast client that doesn’t have arbitrary RSS feed support is choking the medium.
Does Overcast create a profile for you based on the podcasts you listen too? I assume you watch TV shows across multiple services. Why should podcasts be different?
I don’t want to use two apps for podcasts. In the same way, I don’t want to have different TVs to have different channels. Yes, overcast does have a directory of podcasts - but I can add any podcast to my feed.
1) It doesn’t do arbitrary RSS feeds (so no independent podcasts). Thus instead of listening to *any* podcast, I only get what @Spotify deigns is good enough 2) It doesn’t have many features that a good podcast app has. 3) I don’t want to promote a closing of an open ecosystem.
I was wondering when the old, disproportionately opinionated, Marco would surface once again.
I’d still watch JRE (paid / unpaid / spotify / youtube whatever ) if he brings backs @elonmusk , @jordanbpeterson , @lexfridman or @naval And would love to see @Casey on JRE.
I don’t get the point, you can use it on your computer app and on your phone app 🤪
calm down, people need to make a living, no?
Brilliant move on Spotify’s part though. Rogan might fail, but think lf the millions of users they’ll onboard. Not everyone will be pissed and many might convert to paying users.
What this comes down to, is creators getting paid. Be mad at your preferred streaming service for not supporting the creator and only profiting off of them.
Used to be a Rogan fan, but this bullshit just made me realize he’s no better than everyone he ever criticized about tech companies controlling things. Hypocrisy at its finest. Good riddance. Hope his podcast tanks
Thank you for the correct use of quote marks. Being in one app, it stops being a podcast!
Cause YouTube is so great
Not the first Podcaster moving there, unfollowed them all. Afraid they will not even notice 😑
Thank you for Overcast and Instapaper. I use each of them daily. Keep doing what you do!
This article about Spotify’s plan to get a market monopoly on podcasting and completely destroy the open system we have today is well worth a read:…
Can they call themselves a podcast if they don't have an rss feed? Legally speaking that is
Yes. Because there’s no “legal” definition of a podcast. I can legally call my dog podcast.
but isn't it trademarked? I can't call my book Coca-Cola
You can’t trademark a single word in common usage and even if some company had trademarked it before it was in common usage they have failed to enforce that trademark and thus it becomes null
How is Podcast? Is he being a good boy?
Realistically though, it is highly unlikely that it is trademarked because it was created long ago by open source geeks not some corporation
I think the term was coined by early Twitter
You should request your money back
Not that I listen to him, but that’s no longer a podcast, it’s a “program”.
Well the good news is... you can listen to our podcast on 6 other platforms, enjoy 😉
Ugh this makes me want to cancel @Spotify .
does that also apply to messaging only available in one app on one platform?
Totally. One hand people bitch and even #Spotify too that they don’t want closed off ecosystems but rather give choice. This ain’t choice. SO AGAIN: WALK YOUR TALK!!! At least @Apple has my back in security and privacy and Apple just WORKS
I imagine a time when companies like Spotify corner the market on podcasts.When that happens, we will be in the world of duopolies,where there will be no new feature development and audio quality degrades significantly. I despise consolidation in an industry like podcasting
Imagine commercial breaks every 11 minutes like AM radio. We're moving backwards now.
Also, you can't just pay Spotify a monthly fee to get rid of the ads. "Even premium users hear ads in Spotify podcasts, so Spotify double-dips with revenue in those cases."
Agreed. Give me an rss feed it I won't bother.
I had the same thoughts, man. It goes against the core of podcast methodology. BS.
They shouldn’t be called podcasts. Instead be referred with their show and episode names. That’s like calling a streaming show behind a proprietary implementation “radio.” (Long) That’s bullshit. (Short)
A $Thing without a feed isn't a podcast.
And f*** any guy who describes himself as "Husband of renowned podcaster @tiffanyarment" while she doesn't even mention you... TOTAL S-I-M-P...
& F*** YouTube for disrespecting their creators.
Do you have the same standards for Netflix, HBO, Showtime etc? Why or why not?
Mine is on umpteen platforms and the web...
Very Sad. With two of the biggest podcast apps exclusive to one platform, Apple Podcasts/ Overcast on iOS, their network effect is too splintered. Spotify is everywhere, they have won. Spotify will be Youtube of audio. They won't even need exclusive contracts soon because–
Celeb broadcasters are already now saying "It's on Spotify" instead of rattling off every other podcast service. Many are starting a new podcast on Anchor and I bet you Anchor will stop serving RSS as default and only publish to Spotify.
Some days I really miss the Fail Whale.
I think this will happen sooner than people think. Not good for an open industry. I used to put any RSS feed into my app of choice. Apple podcasts. Not anymore. That's going away.
Spotify has not "won". Spotify is the Adobe Flash of this era. It will die a similarly ignominious death.
Will it? Google Music is shutting down. What is left? Apple Music and Deezer?
If you mean Google Play Music, it's shutting down because of YouTube Music.
Definitely not enough opera and oratorio available for my subscription dollars. Thanks for the tech prediction.
I remember asking if you could make it so I don’t see his podcast every time I try to search for new shows to add. Thank you so much for adding that feature for me.
The only podcast I love enough to be this mad that it moved behind a paywall is @_penaddictfm on @_RelayFM. Otherwise, there's enough of great value to fill the time of one's life at arm's reach that I doubt any other podcast would budge my sense of peace.
fuck you too - spotify
And what do think about @WIRED using only IOS for online subscriptions? Oh, you can also use a Fire tablet. Wow!
I think I am just fine without WIRED. I have never subscribed to them and never will.
You and @exponentfm spoke about how this was coming and how it will break the ecosystem. We saw this coming.
One thing I would want to see in Overcast (which is amazing) is a better discovery mechanic. I suspect we will see YouTube like growth and discovery is lacking.
Not sure if you taking suggestions or not :)
Fuck Joe Rogan too though, he still has Alex Jones on the podcast and is constantly making shit up about Covid
If a podcast is only playable in one app, it doesn’t adhere to the podcast protocol. I listen to over 60 podcasts, I can’t say I’ve ever heard of that issue though. People put videos on you tube and call them podcasts. They are not!
So successful podcasters are not allowed to monetize themselves? How is it different to a screenwriter signing to Apple TV?
I'm glad @siracusa did not like that cringeworthy tweet. Overcast is great for the shownotes and listening to @atpfm. What's wrong with exclusive podcasts and Spotify? At least they load faster and are more easily available on all platforms. Overcast is not available on desktop.
Overcast is available on desktop through the web interface! And there's no such thing as an Overcast Exclusive, as it uses the same open RSS system as most other podcast apps. Meanwhile Spotify is only available on Spotify's app, and no other. A bad move
Was one of the first people "pod casting" back in like 2005 with @adamcurry, from my #PalmPilot and doing the RSS manually, before anyone at Apple had even heard of it and nobody had ever Spotified. Platform locking is the antithesis of the medium. But here we are.
Eventually money ruins everything.
Agree, it’s a horrible plan
They’re going reignite torrenting. 😅
Marco, with you, love independent podcasters, love your app. Love podcasters who need to make a living. Fuck Spotify and anyone thinking they should be exclusive on that platform.
I dunno. Perhaps six too many words. ;-)
Did you ever listen to the Metal Gear Solid 4 podcast? You could only listen to it on the iPod within the PlayStation 3 game.
MGS4 Integral Podcast Episode 1 - Advent Palace (1/2) [HD]
MGS4 Integral Podcast Episode One (1/2) [HD]
I mean now people have uploaded it to YouTube. But still.
He sold out.... Greedy
It’s not a podcast if that’s the case, it’s an isolated audio file.
Isn’t that the worst. Podcasts turning into the stratification of streaming tv.
Agreed but at least it’s not a show I’ll miss
Must be new to media and the content business. The same playbook is applied no matter how often the medium changes. This is America the Free, not America, for Free. (I am being mostly facetious).
Actually Fuck ivoox, Who wants podcasters to pay to "unlimit their feeds"... REALLY?!
Oh and the podcasts that are playable everywhere else except Spotify
But not fuck when somebody hands you $100 million plus? Wake up!
Their interface for Podcasts is mind numbingly horrid.
I was gonna try them out to see the differences between them and Apple Music.... but this podcast crap is a no go.
This in a big way. Buying up democratized media is a terrible look, regardless of the garbage, pseudo-intellectual target
Right up there with websites that only work in one browser
Paywalled RSS feeds suck
Why not? Their paid-for podcast works in any app that can import an RSS feed (which is all of them). They’re not trying to monopolise the ecosystem like Spotify
People refuse to see the difference between open and free. I went through this when I launched the Daily Update as well
Nobody should pay for other people’s work. Nobody.* * you really have to clarify sarcasm these days on Twitter
So, ignoring for a moment any variance in listener figures… If Spotify backed a truck up and offered you guys $200 million to make ATP a Spotify exclusive (which I saw reported as what they're paying for Rogan) would you turn them down? @caseyliss @siracusa
Tell them to call us and we’ll find out.
Blame youtube and their chosen censorship policies pushing one distinct ideology. Or blame the guy thats getting paid after 10 years of free content I guess...your choice.
You realize Rogan makes between $64 and $240 million revenue per year from the podcast alone. It’s not like his podcast is not turning a profit.
Howard Stern is Getting Ripped Off
Why podcasting may have minted its first billionaire, subscription podcasting is the next great business model, and how to join the…
Medium has entered the chat....
Kevin Smith took the SmodCO back-catalogue behind the Stitchr paywall, that lasted IIRC less than a year, now its behind his own paywall with passworded standard RSS feeds. Would be interesting to hear you chat to him on a podcast about that.
Yea, fuck proprietary crap! Right. Right?
For all values of “pod” smaller than 2
Such a compassionate, inclusive progressive
Yeah and every tv show should be available in every single app.
Also, not incidentally, Spotify as a podcast player is trash.
That’s a lot of anger. I think this is about more than being able to play podcast... Wish you good and positive thoughts.
Agreed. On the other hand @joerogan gotta get that money. I'd much rather prefer they'd be everywhere including Spotify. Exclusivity is tough. I'm sure the loss for Joe won't be significant in terms of audience. He's the king of podcasts afterall.
The way I figure it is I’ll actually use Spotify for podcasts meaning one less app to keep up with. I feel like the money is fair for what he’ll do for the platform plus the gigantic back catalogue they also licensed.
I think people are very upset with the fact that it's not an open internet thing anymore. Spotify is platforming audio. Honestly, someone was gonna do it. It's gonna end up like the on demand video wars. Apple is gonna move next. I'm very surprised they didn't already.
My thoughts exactly! And when Apple does it, it will be praised. The outrage is selective, and fleeting. If you didn’t think this would begin to happen, then you haven’t been paying attention to the increasing popularity of podcasts.
The problem is you can’t manually add any podcast feed you want to Spotify. It has to be something that the show owner has submitted to be included in the Spotify catalog.
Yeah, but this move might make content creators push to this platform just like Apple Podcasts which seems to be the default.
Apple provides an open directory of freely available podcasts. They don’t host anyone’s content. And they allow you to add any feed you want, even if it isn’t in their directory.
The beauty of a deep and open framework like RSS is that it doesn’t require content creators to adopt anyone’s specific platform and the limitations of said platform.
at least i can use spotify on linux. what about other music services?
Especially one as big as Rogan. It’s one thing to develope your own exclusive shit. It’s another to pluck it out of the market.
Would you like some cheese with that whine?
You’re crying about another man signing $100 million dollar deal because you’re too broke to spend $9.99 a month to listen to him?
It’s only about the name.
You don't have to spend $9.99 to listen to him. Free listeners will still get access to it, but it's not right for podcasts to become exclusive to one platform.
Says who though? Let that man get his money.
That's it! I'm using YouTube Music and downloading Spotify Podcasts MP3s from now on.
It’s not even about Rogan... it’s about giving power to a player that won’t use open standards for a medium that grew into what it is BECAUSE of those open standards
Who’s feeding Joe Rogan’s family, you or him? His grand kids are set for life now.
Umm, he was already making over $250 million per year with his show.
Now, we’re using flat out lies to prove a point. Awesome. 👍🏼
Sorry, should have looked for a verified source. Still, $30M is nothing to shake a stick at.
$100 million >>>> $30 million
Yes, you predicted it when @abexlumberg sold them Gimlet too.
Legit might cancel my Spotify membership just because of this. Fuck them.
Someone should go ahead and freeboot them all.
So podcasts are really like sports now I guess 🤦🏻‍♂️
I’d like to see you turn down millions of dollars to be exclusive to a platform. It’s about money at the end of the day.
I found out that I stop listening to podcasts that move to Spotify only. Even the ones I really liked. And that’s not a protest or anything, I intended to continue listening in Spotify, but just never got to it.
I’m not worried about Rogan — he’ll get cancelled sooner or later. Sadly, however, this list now includes some recent launches by the McElroys.
Come on, tell us how you really feel Marco
I watch Joe Rogan in YouTube. Apparently the JRE Clips channel will continue, but the full episode videos will no longer be available after the full transition to Spotify.
Let’s hope so! The clips are perfect 👌
All should be playable only in Overcast. That’s exactly what I was thinking! 😜
someone is really upset. People love podcasts. An area to improve with Spotify.
How about founding a worldwide „Free podcast alliance“? All other podcast apps join their forces and implement a single support/payment system for the publishers?
At least it's not Tidal
Rather than complain why not get building a system that enables locked podcasts and payments ? The writing is on the wall.  will do it soon
Wouldn’t surprise me if  doesn’t add a system in their app, but more likely an Pay API that all podcast apps can use. In your shoes I’d get building. People like John Gruber are into charging for podcasts, he won’t be the last. It’s such a seductive concept to charge
If many people think like you, the market will punish @Spotify (and @joerogan). If not then it was a good decision for him to get all that money. In any case, freedom is an amazing thing.
If you pay spotify you are part of the problem. @Spotify is @Tradedoubler a scam in any way. We all wait for Daniel Ek to leave earth.
I have to think there's a viable market out there of people who are prepared to pay for podcasts - that are sick of hearing the same adverts over and over again for mattresses, hosted cms, subscription socks or razors, suitcases and domain names.
How do you know it’s only playable on one app? DSP’s have a truce that no artist will be given exclusive deals. Joe budden podcast is signed to Spotify but 3 days later they upload the video to YouTube on there own channel.
I use Overcast for podcasts and Deezer for music. Always wary of the big boys.
It is getting major podcasters paid, while still being free. I wonder how many more commercials we will be privy to to pay Rogan's 100 million dollar contract...
Hi Marco, I can clone your app for Android if you have plans.
Aren’t you a big Howard Stern fan?This is just a modern day retelling of his story.
It should not be called a podcast, as what @SnazzyQ said, it's not a podcast if it's locked on a single platform
Marco said it first! :)
The open-web only supports an advertising model and leaves content creators at the whims of YT, FB, demonetization, algorithms, etc. That the alternative of working on the Spotify plantation might not be so bad should make one think about the status quo.
Couldn't agree more. How does this apply to subscription-only podcasts? Is it better to spread subscriptions across different platforms?
You can monetize the network.
Zactly! This “new” arms race of non-interoperabilty is toxic AF. Marco, look for an email last week on getting Tunr’s music vis catalog into Overcast! These are (were) some of the visuals in iTunes!
Love the podcast but have to agree, it is complete bullshit.
When is Overcast supporting Sonos? 🙏
I couldn't agree more!
Digital frustrated?
The NFL of audio content
Fuck YouTube for demonetisation and censorship im sure it played a big part in him wanting to move off the platform and also 100m dollars anyone with a brain would take that deal
If it is exclusive to a network or app, If not available to everyone through an open RSS feed, If I have to create an account and give personal information, if I cant subscribe, download and listen through my app of choice, IT IS NOT A PODCAST. ($100m sound like hush money)
Joe Rogan did what Howard did a decade earlier. He left the free airwaves and went to XM. Howard stopped being on the radio and Joe will stop being on a podcast. @adamcurry just wait till Spotify controls which guests he’s allowed to have on!
Huge difference: Stern went behind a paywall and JRE will still be free.
At this stage, it’s not a podcast, though - it’s a show like any other media show that is exclusive to a media channel.
Wander what the stats are for the countries that don’t have Spotify for the ol’ rogan... you’d hope they took that into consideration...
Marco, what do you think about their strategy with Winds of Change. They are pushing that podcast to every platform, but made the whole thing available on spottily first.
Its free on plex, not sure if that will change 😂
marco mad he not getting paid $100m to talk
Why should he feel obligated to publish his content on various platforms? Shouldn't it be up to him?
I wouldn’t even have a problem with that if spotify podcast experience wasn’t so shitty - last time I checked, progress wasn’t even syncing between devices. Useless...
You seem friendly!
Fuck anything not made in USA? Spotify is fucking awesome. Get over it.
Lmao what? Buying content exclusivity rights is an incredibly normal business practice. Might as well say fuck the free world while you’re at it.
Don't know what the problem is but since I also don't like Spotify (skips too many times to other artists and it doesn't make it easy to play only the artist I chose) so yeah! F'it!!!
The problem is that it deceives people into thinking there's such thing as podcasts that don't have RSS feeds and can't listened and be subscribed by anybody independently of having or *not* an account.
Really? What a shitty service/company! I'm now even happier I don't use it. (did the trial, didn't like it)
Look at what happened to the "open" web? That's like growing the RMS beard and crying to the wind. Solution: Move on, and sell it.
Granted is not ideal, I rather the exclusive goes to Spotify than Google or Apple 🤢
Yep! I don't listen to Rogan. Never have and probably never will, but this continued push to make podcasts exclusive and put them behind a paywall drives me freaking insane.
(Possibly sensitive)
100% agree. Only thing @OvercastFM is missing IMO is better desktop support. When I'm at my computer, I don't want to use my phone. Really, I just want my "on-the-go" playlist I made to be available on desktop. Just don't want remember all I had queued up. Thanks for Overcast!
Don’t wanna say it’s Apple’s fault but it’s Apple‘s fault. They had a decade head start but have largely left podcasts alone, taking for granted that podcasters and listeners would just use their platform, without giving anything back.
Have you considered releasing your Forecast app to the public as a bigger push for creating and distributing podcasts openly? 3/4 of podcasts on Spotify are created using Anchor per
The podcasting world is now Spotify versus everybody else
The future of podcasting is forming now.
I'm for one, won't move
Would you say the same for any app that doesn't create for both Android and iOS? Exclusivity is
really think the exclusivity is a noose - he's going to be cuffed by Daddy Spotify and won't be so open about certain issues. Then again, he made his $$$
Right, imo, it defeats the whole purpose of why podcasts are successful
Tried to listen to a Spotify exclusive podcast in the car the other day. It was excruciating. Other exclusivity issues aside, going exclusive on a platform that’s currently so bad at podcasts seems like suicide.
an interesting take. i wonder what Marco would say/do if Spotify came along and offered him millions of $$$ for Overcast.
Mistakenly thought the future of podcasting lies in Democratization.. 😬
Lol calm down Karen
well we only have to wait for a popular opinion until someone cries “censorship” as the platform throws them out(1). (1) The Web, earlier and now.
Totally agree. #GoogleGestapo needs a Web 3.0 that is open, federation, cloud free (mesh), you own your own data, and nothing can ever be censored. #UNRIG #MEGA
This seems America centric since I don’t know who this man is. I don’t care about Spotify for many reasons, but mainly because it’s got very bad UX for listening to music so I’ll just leave it at that and never use it for podcasts either 😂
As a husband to an artist, who has yet to see a single cent paid out by Spotify for the thousands of streams her music has been played, I wonder where Spotify finds the funds to invest so heavily into podcasting. Shouldn't they pay artist for the music they exploit instead 😡
Overcast is the best podcast app: I pay for it despite excellent free alternatives That being said, it's AWESOME for creators that @audible_com @ApplePodcasts & @Spotify are paying for exclusives because it will remove the top 100 podcasters & let new voices emerge!
Castro is better 😉
It’s free. Who cares.
Agree. But: are no longer Podcast but Radio Shows.
If it ain’t playable on multiple apps, I am not listening.
I'm mildly entertained by Rogan but not enough to use Spotify just to listen to him. They use a shit quality codec, have tons of garbage tracks, and treat artists like dirt. So yeah, fuck spotify.
Hi, Marco!We would like to receive your audio comment about this situation for our podcast. It would be great to get your comment in next 16 hours, cause the podcast will be released оn Monday.Let me know if it’s possible. Waiting for your answer 🙌
I’m not a fan of the podcast everyone is upset about... but I’m curious what would happen if I create an RSS feed that plays within an hour of release the latest episodes of said podcast?