Convopage
See the entire conversation
What should we improve or add in a future Deno release that would make you say “FINALLY”?
231 replies and sub-replies as of May 21 2022
http benchmark showing that Deno is faster than node. Also, bytecode caching could be nice.
We're working on the benchmarks.
For bytecode caching follow github.com/denoland/deno/… (it'd be great to state your use case in the issue).
Support caching/emitting bytecode · Issue #3335 · denoland/deno
@ry mentioned to me that V8 supports a way to transpile modules to byte code. In theory we could persist that in the cache instead of JavaScript. Different than snapshots, which are code running in...
github.com
FFI callbacks 👀
ARM (RPi) build!
can deno run TS transpilers? i.e : esbuild, webpack, etc...
Yes, you can use esbuild with Deno: deno.land/x/esbuild@v0.1…
and @vitest_dev for Deno
Vite should already run with Deno's compat mode. Give it a try!
Awesome! So every blocker has been resolved now? Looks like that is the case from the tracking issue 🙌
How is the experience of using Vite in Deno been for you?
Improve Node Compat Mode · Issue #12577 · denoland/deno
Make various popular projects run: Vite frontend development tool @bartlomieju blocked on http client work blocked on http hijacking for web sockets #12718 Mongo DB Driver @AaronO blocked on tls de...
github.com
Framework like Nest.js
What would you want this command to bootstrap?
I'm working in this in a opensource project you can check this here @dpm_land or
GitHub - dpmland/dpm: The missing Deno Package Manager
The missing Deno Package Manager :sauropod:. Contribute to dpmland/dpm development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
This is a little problematic, since there are many use-cases for deno with even more variants of tooling to choose from.
I for myself made me three deno template repos on GitHub.
The first one is a repo for building a script:
GitHub - codemonument/deno-scripting-template: A template repo for developing scripts with deno. These scripts can be compiled to single js files or even bundled with the deno executable for distribution.
A template repo for developing scripts with deno. These scripts can be compiled to single js files or even bundled with the deno executable for distribution. - GitHub - codemonument/deno-scripting...
github.com
This can be used to build a deno script with a main.ts file which can either be executed directly as s command via deno run, via deno install or can even be bundled or compiled to be used as cli or Npm package
Another template repo of mine is a scraping template with deno. It has a setup to use puppeteer for scraping websites.
GitHub - codemonument/deno-scraping-template: A template repo for developing scrapers with deno. This is intended to be used by the developer himself to accomplish some kind of data retrieval from websites, but the resulting script can also be compiled to single js files or even bundled with the deno executable for distribution.
A template repo for developing scrapers with deno. This is intended to be used by the developer himself to accomplish some kind of data retrieval from websites, but the resulting script can also be...
github.com
And the latest one is a repo template tailored for developing deno modules.
It tries to minimize external tooling besides deno cli.
GitHub - codemonument/deno-module-template: A template made for publishing a module to deno.land/x
A template made for publishing a module to deno.land/x - GitHub - codemonument/deno-module-template: A template made for publishing a module to deno.land/x
github.com
In the end, I see a better fit for these generators as deno modules in userland. One could start an „Awesome“ Repo to curate the best generators for deno repos, maybe even curated by the deno team to give them extended visibility :)
All of these look great & tbh if there was a `deno new` command to generate one of these project types it would be ideal.
EG: `deno new --module`, `deno new --script`, `deno new --cli`, etc
The closest I have built atm is this:
GitHub - NuroDev/deno-module: 🦕 Template repository to help bootstrap a new Deno module
🦕 Template repository to help bootstrap a new Deno module - GitHub - NuroDev/deno-module: 🦕 Template repository to help bootstrap a new Deno module
github.com
And a tsconfig.json with sane defaults
Demo ships with sane TS defaults out of the box. In most cases you don't need to change any TS settings
This. Please help us bootstrap new projects with the most minimal amount of files and content needed to get it working. I don't have the time to look for the correct packages (if any) and the structure of whatever permissions/commands I need.
is working on Prisma integration
An alternative to Electron
Would integration with Tauri solve your use case?
Honestly it looks pretty complicated, so I don’t think so.
Tauri is super easy to use, and I've had a better experience so far than I did with Electron. I'd love to see Deno work with Tauri.
I spoke too soon, I should try it… I just see stuff about XCode and whatnot and it makes me nervous.
I think the only XCode related thing is just a single command to install the dependencies. But other than that, it's all JS (and optionally a bit of rust).
the logo should represent the strength and security of the available features
Support for JSI could be sweet
TRY/CATCH
Prisma 🤩 @prisma
is working on it
child process
Deno supports spawning child processes, you can use Deno.run/Deno.spawn/Den… APIs for it
The deal breaker is I can’t use fp-ts 😿 Types are somehow broken. Also, auto-organize imports would be great.
Different inferred type when importing - fp-ts · Issue #300 · esm-dev/esm.sh
Failing module GitHub: https://github.com/gcanti/fp-ts npm: https://www.npmjs.com/package/fp-ts Inferred type of result is different when using esm.sh & Deno: import { sequenceT } from &...
github.com
Project bootstraping like npx… “deno create lume-site@1.9.0 blog”
You can with deno.land/x/trex@v1.11.0… and deno.land/x/land@v0.9.2
deno as such you don't need a package manager but if you need close to npm experience you can see: deno.land/x/trex@v1.11.0 or deno.land/x/udd@0.7.3
It needs to be official
Deno don’t need packages manager
Kkkkkk
brilliants of Deno is no need packages and managers
But I need a package manager.
built in modern ssr
Take a look at fresh: github.com/lucacasonato/f… it will soon be production ready and an "official" Deno project
GitHub - lucacasonato/fresh: Preact, but super edgy
Preact, but super edgy. Contribute to lucacasonato/fresh development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
finally 😁
great project💪 I'm waiting for production ready and take a taste
A way to get debug logging. I’d like to know if deno is downloading modules to the cache.
There’s also moments where deno is frozen during startup doing something but I have no idea what. Having some visibility into that would help.
Deno always print "Download ..." messages when it is downloading module from the internet.
As for the "frozen" during startup; do you see "Check ..." prompt before this freeze happens?
True but there’s no time stamp in the log line, so it’s difficult to tell how long that step took.
Can you open an issue about it with some details what this feature should support?
Sure!
Custom JSX transform.
Can you elaborate?
I would like to use Solid.js with Deno. Would be awesome if we could plug in a custom AST transform for JSX.
Agreed.
I feel like @solid_js & @deno_land could be a dream combo! 💪
Isn't it @davedbase wet dream? 🤔
YES PLEASE! This would be so freaken awesome.
But seriously, a Solid future would surely involve Deno. We need a modern runtime for a modern reactive UI library. Super, duper bullish on Deno.
I'm sure we can figure something out to support Solid in Deno
I could probably rally some of our community support. Let me know how I can help make this happen. Our Discord is VERY helpful and opinionated as well.
Deno supports custom JSX factories, including the "new" JSX runtime. There are multiple libraries that "just work" with Deno. Better "out of the box" support though for SolidJS would be good, but likely the fundamentals are in place already.
Deno - A modern runtime for JavaScript and TypeScript
Deno is a simple, modern runtime for JavaScript and TypeScript that uses V8 and is built in Rust.
deno.land
Unfortunately, this is not sufficient, as these fundamentals don’t really help. Solid performs AST transformations that the “new” JSX runtime doesn’t allow for. To support Solid, Deno must allow for something like SWC plugins.
Package Manager
deno as such you don't need a package manager but if you need close to npm experience you can see: deno.land/x/trex@v1.11.0 or deno.land/x/udd@0.7.3
Oh That's The Thing That I Don't Know Thanks For This Suggestion..
package-level permissions instead of process level.
I would 100% switch to deno if I could allow the filesystem, but only for the main module, not all subsequents node_modules inside it.
That would prevent most malicious JS modules right?
This has been discussed multiple times and we haven't come up with a way to do that would actually be secure. @lcasdev can say more about it
Yeah that one sounds tricky tbh.
I'll be glad to read a little more on the subject, and see the options you've considered if you have a link or something.
Hardened JavaScript!
There's no cli to do it yet, but you can achieve what you need by using tools from github.com/endojs/endo/
For now github.com/LavaMoat/lavam… can provide policy based access to powerful objects.
github.com/tc39/proposal-…
GitHub - tc39/proposal-ses: Draft proposal for SES (Secure EcmaScript)
Draft proposal for SES (Secure EcmaScript). Contribute to tc39/proposal-ses development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
With the current state of JS, it is fundamentally infeasible to do securely. There is work in TC39 to make this possible eventually (github.com/tc39/proposal-…). This work is being led mostly by folks at Agoric
GitHub - tc39/proposal-ses: Draft proposal for SES (Secure EcmaScript)
Draft proposal for SES (Secure EcmaScript). Contribute to tc39/proposal-ses development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
I sympathize with the hard realities.
OTOH I never invested time into Deno because I couldn't get past how coarse access control is - what is the practical use case for it being that way?
What I want is something like lunatic.solutions where module isolation is built-in.
Lunatic - An Erlang-inspired runtime for WebAssembly
Lunatic is an open-source WebAssembly runtime and platform for running server-side applications
lunatic.solutions
You can isolate dependencies by importing them inside workers, and isolate the permissions for that workers.
Deno - A modern runtime for JavaScript and TypeScript
Deno is a simple, modern runtime for JavaScript and TypeScript that uses V8 and is built in Rust.
deno.land
I think this would make people mass adopt deno. No other platform supports this and it's really important feature in these days
No type checking by default but that's already coming.
Yep! In v1.23, next month, "deno run" will no longer type-check by default.
That's crazy. Definitely something that will prevent me from using it.
How so?
Because I use TypeScript due its type-checking. If it is disabled per default, there's no point in using TypeScript for me. That's like disabling type-checking in gcc per default and let the IDE instead try to cover it.
You'll still be able to use it with --check flag and commands like "deno test" and "deno bench" will still type check by default
Meh, sure. It's workaround to a fundamental problem of TS being slow. I'm more the type who solves problems fundamentally rather than pushing them away. A type checker in a fast language is the way to go instead of hiding type checking behind a flag.
That is most likely not true. Even the TypeScript team is skeptical using a "fast" language would provide significant speedups.
Converting the architecture used to type check in the current type-checker won't give any substantial performance improvements when written in another language, that's correct. But there are other architectures like converting to byte-code and run in a VM that has not been tested
Please read github.com/tc39/proposal-… and related reasoning by the TypeScript team on their blog, it might give you an alternative point of view.
GitHub - tc39/proposal-type-annotations: ECMAScript proposal for type syntax that is erased - Stage 1
ECMAScript proposal for type syntax that is erased - Stage 1 - GitHub - tc39/proposal-type-annotations: ECMAScript proposal for type syntax that is erased - Stage 1
github.com
What alternative POV should that give me regarding type checking?
Basically that type checking is a form of linting but it's up to you how you interpret it.
Certainly, the same could be said about other type-checkers in other languages. But that doesn't mean I'm in favor of disabling them by default.
I don't think you can just lint C# or Java, TypeScript is special in this.
Not sure what you're trying to say, but GCC supports "lint-only", so does Go. I've no knowledge about c#/java. But it's more about the opposite, isn't it?: Let gcc/go compile without telling you any errors, so you only see them at runtime as a segfault.
Go supports lint-only, i.e., it can run an incorrectly typed code? That's news to me.
Exactly, that's not possible - for good reasons. Yet, Deno not only allows that, it makes it a default.
You can't claim that Go is lint-only and the opposite at the same time. Please make up your mind.
Lint-only mode doesn't mean it runs incorrectly typed code. Go/gcc can "lint" only, correct. They can't compile incorrectly typed code, correct. Both are correct.
> Lint-only mode doesn't mean it runs incorrectly typed code.
It does. Deno (and e.g. Next.js) can run incorrectly typed code. It's the whole point.
I think we refer to different "it". I can lint-only my C++ code, but that doesn't mean it will compile and run. But the whole point is that Deno allows me (per default) to run completely incorrectly typed code, whereas gcc/Go do not - for good reasons.
database support. only thing making me use deno not as often as i wish i could
Are you talking about missing DB drivers? Which DBs do you want to use?
especially mongodb
Deno has mongo db driver. Try this one deno.land/x/mongo@v0.30.0
anyone know if oracledb is supported?
QUIC
a boiler-plate for a full-stack app.
Just create-deno-fullstack and a repo with full backend-frontend capability is ready to be spin up!
Permissions for imported packages
package-level permissions instead of process level.
I would 100% switch to deno if I could allow the filesystem, but only for the main module, not all subsequents node_modules inside it.
That would prevent most malicious JS modules right?
Seems like a miss that you can't do this.
You can isolate dependencies by importing them inside workers, and isolate the permissions for that workers.
Deno - A modern runtime for JavaScript and TypeScript
Deno is a simple, modern runtime for JavaScript and TypeScript that uses V8 and is built in Rust.
deno.land
Svelte/sveltekit
Even more options for sandboxing:
- V8 flags for workers, for limiting memory usage, for example. For processor I know it's hard.
- importmap for workers or a way to limit imports to a specific folder.
Being able to mix deno + non-deno code in the same repo/workspace. i.e. better VSCode tooling to support this case.
I'd love to incrementally move to deno, but I need my frontend code to be written with "traditional" TS still.
You can have mixed projects using "demo.enabledPaths" setting in vscode_deno
GitHub - denoland/vscode_deno: Visual Studio Code plugin for Deno
Visual Studio Code plugin for Deno. Contribute to denoland/vscode_deno development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
That's cool! I didn't know that existed, I'll give it a try.
To share this setup with other devs, though, I would have to check in vscode settings to the repo. Might be nice to have an alternative like a `#!` file header or a per-folder configuration.
Also, I'd love to have native support for deno in AWS Lambda/cloud functions. But that's less of a feature thing.
then/catch.. 😁
Deno dino plushies
Automatic cookie handling in the Fetch API, like the browser. I know there’s the “another_cookejar” module, but I’d trust in built-in functionality more.
In the bigger scheme of things, Deno needs to be an order of magnitude better than node. If that’s not happening, the migration won’t be happening either as it’s more difficult to break the status quo than just being first.
I don’t think that Deno will replace Nodejs, they’ll live along each other. There won’t be a migration but people will chose their favorite. As an example, I don’t think that angular/react teams will migrate so nodejs will still be chosen for these.
you heard it, now we need to merge it 😛
Browser bundling
Deno doesn't currently do anything for browser bundling. Other Remix team members have more context on this, but we had a hard time using what Deno offers out of the box to ship something that worked on both the server and in the browser.
Have you seen github.com/lucacasonato/f… ? It's using Deno.emit as far as I remember
GitHub - lucacasonato/fresh: Preact, but super edgy
Preact, but super edgy. Contribute to lucacasonato/fresh development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
I know. Remix *already* supports Deno. :) I just think it'd be cool if Deno thought a bit about apps that run on both the server and client.
They are trying! :) I think esbuild and github.com/denoland/deno_… are considered the way to do it right now, but it's a long way to go compared with node
GitHub - denoland/deno_emit: Transpile and bundle JavaScript and TypeScript under Deno and Deno Deploy
Transpile and bundle JavaScript and TypeScript under Deno and Deno Deploy - GitHub - denoland/deno_emit: Transpile and bundle JavaScript and TypeScript under Deno and Deno Deploy
github.com
What about vite? twitter.com/biwanczuk/stat…
Vite should already run with Deno's compat mode. Give it a try!
Single-letter aliases for "allow" flags other than "--allow-all".
mTLS support for custom http client. Mentioned here, but I don’t think it happened yet(?)
Configurable HTTP client · Issue #3444 · denoland/deno
This is a separate issue following up the conversation in #2301. Currently, Deno doesn't support self-signed server certificates which are used by almost all Kubernetes deployments, includi...
github.com
Configuring the "log-level" for console.{debug, info, warning, error} statements.
Please elaborate
I would like to see a flag for deno-run to set the logging level. And have the console commands respect that.
Maybe even expose it as part of the Deno namespace to let logging libraries respect it as well.
I think the problem here is, that deno is able to distribute typescript based binaries, but for the compiled tooling we need to fall back to the known OS level package managers.
This means, someone should setup some kind of package manager in style of brew but cross platform 😂
Maybe better (or worse) idea: write a clone of npm or a mvp of that which runs on deno.
This way we can could simply use the npm package ecosystem from node.
We could also limit the use packages exporting binaries.
The very least we could re-use the node tar.gz packages.
API to run ast transforms before execution
Can you expand a little bit on what you mean?
Support for setting memory limits on workers
Files embedded right into the compiled file. Currently I have to objcopy them into the file.
Is there a bench that compares deno to cloudflare workers?
I need to know bootstrap time, memory etc.
I think what could push it over the top for more adoption is not really a feature added but having more creators creating video tutorials on how to use Deno on YouTube. Say how to create applications with Deno. Just my thoughts.
nestjs support
Haven't checked in on Deno in a while, love it tho. So not sure current status. Apologize ignorance:
Deno has the right security model. Could it also run WebWorkers & non-DOM WebGL wrapper? Even headless?
I ask because of @SecureRender.
Woah! Wow. Humbled and grateful people are working on that. Even better. I'm excited for the future!
Deno is awesome! There are only a few things I wish Deno had:
🤏 --minify option for `deno bundle`
🔐 JsonWebToken in Standard Library
🍃 MongoDB ODM (Happy to see DangoDB is being released)
🔺 Prisma and
⚛️ Electron alternatives
Do you have support for HTTP integration tests?
Please elaborate. We have a lot of testing helpers in deno_std. In most cases using "fetch" API is enough for such tests
It's not about the CLI, but: Type stripping when deno.land/x is serving to the browser. The pull request is ready to go if a lazy-transpilation approach is viable:
feat(registry): Add on the fly compilation by AnInternetTroll · Pull Request #1902 · denoland/dotland
fixes #1728
github.com
Compiling to native binary like Rust, currently the binaries are too big for a simple hello world app, but that's a huge amount of work though
try catch
*node_modules*
Very fast execution of unit tests
Is the current speed of "deno test" not fast enough?
Yeah, I don't think it's too slow. I like that it skips the typechecker. I meant that enabling very fast iteration is something that's appealing about deno.
Native AWS Lambda integration.
DOT Products / Matrix Math
A JDBC(java)-like database driver API
Limiting network bandwidth. I know it’s possible to limit cpu and memory via cgroups but network is different.
speed , still node is fast more than half use case
work seamlessly with nodejs packages 🤷
Async local storage (github.com/denoland/deno/…) and I'd start porting Saltcorn to deno tomorrow and be like bye bye node npm dumpster fire.
Thread local storage is must for developing multitenant applications.
Support continuation/async local storage · Issue #7010 · denoland/deno
This issue is basically requesting the deno equivalent of https://www.npmjs.com/package/@northscaler/continuation-local-storage or https://nodejs.org/dist/latest-v14.x/docs/api/async_hooks.html#asy...
github.com
Some examples of a frontend app - how to run react / vue (eg using vite)
Deno still feels a “backend side language”
Node is now Deno
SSG working
Flow support
a package manager
Are you thinking of AssemblyScript?
Something like npm ? 📦 👌🏿
Express
package-level permissions instead of process level.
I would 100% switch to deno if I could allow the filesystem, but only for the main module, not all subsequents node_modules inside it.
That would prevent most malicious JS modules right?
Object capability security model for packages
Permissions per package and all its children
Cross process BroadcastChannel!
I've been 👀👀👀 for this ever since it was on the near-term upcoming roadmap pre the nodejs-compat singularity
Support cross process BroadcastChannel · Issue #10750 · denoland/deno
Follow-up to #10354 This will require some prerequisite work: handle origin scoping correctly, and add origin as property of message figure out how to do IPC between processes - likely the best way...
github.com
Async import on deno deploy
One more, vertically:
I
n
d
e
x
e
d
D
B
Add support for IndexedDB · Issue #1699 · denoland/deno
It'll be useful to have IndexedDB in Deno. Related to #1657.
github.com
Get FFI support to stable, automatic bindgen with C libraries, and passing callbacks through FFIed functions.
Would make developing our GTK Deno bindings a lot easier ;)
Just recently use deno for authoring a lib and really love it if `deno bench` measure memory and obj-allocs statistics too
A reason to exist.
By now, most of the people who were starting to become dissatisfied with Node moved to Golang.
Everyone who stuck with Node stuck with it primarily for things like ecosystem and familiarity.
What does Deno offer that’s so great compared to either Node or Go?
I know you may be asking me what the current year is, but...an IIS hosting module?
VM Context execute Javascript
Native node_modules/ folder support.
(I know, I know. You can skip your lecture.)
I know I might get scolded for this, but a fully working node.js compatibility layer, so you don't have to do without most of the well-established js ecosystem when switching to deno.
I'd love to be able to use deno with frameworks like nextjs
Performance 10x better then nodejs. Otherwise there is no incentive of using deno tbh.
Hot dogs
Socks proxies for websockets
npm compatiblity
Official bazel rules maybe, instead of package manager
A proper built-in dependency manager
Low level TLS stuff such as accessing information inside ClientHello.
Don't sell yourself to OpenJS Foundation