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Americans blaming Venezuela on ‘socialism’, when right-wing generals did the same to half of latam but ‘socialism’ didn’t do it to Europe
62 replies and sub-replies as of Aug 03 2017
There should be a term for people who don’t understand economies are systems and you can’t change any given part just by passing a law
You can try running it in more (Scandi) or less (USA) ‘socialist’ ways. Breaking it by not understanding the system exists is another thing
It helps if you don't use "socialism" when you mean "generous welfare state". Scandinavian governments don't go around seizing businesses
This, Scandinavia isnt seizing land and means of production. It isnt heavy stablishing trade regulations
Not all socialists produce a Venezuela, and not all Venezuelas have been produced by socialists.
They are none the less socialist. That is the error - you’re defining only a certain kind of idiot as socialism
Capitalism at varying rates of taxes and benefits is different from the government owning the businesses, calling it socialism is the error
Whatever it’s called, my impression is the Scandi way is the better way. More happy and healthy people.
Right wing generals seizing businesses isn't a different economic system from democratically elected socialists doing the same
I mean if you cant blame a system for the demise of dozens of countries (large and small) then I dont know.
And even more, you cant single out a sucessful socialist nation because there isnt, which is not the case for liberalism or social dems
Pretty much all ‘social democratic’ parties would call themselves socialists. The UK Labour Party is ‘socialist’.
Sure, but are they?
Of course. You’re trying to define only a certain kind of fool as socialist and that is not correct
I define it by its historical context, the state involving in social welfare is not socialism. Its obviously "leftie", not but socialism.
Any more than the U.S. is purely Capitalist. You're making an irrelevant distinction.
Yeah but if the leaders are aggressive or outspoken socialists or similar Socialism has to share blame. Long term Socialist policies.
The way all ‘capitalists’ should share blame for Pinochet? No.
Agree. In a different way.
Citing Scandi at high level in US seems silly. US left aspires to Robin Hood. Not homogenous, everyone pays more, solidarity.
It's as much a product of a v diff political culture as Venezuela is.
But it was a form of socialism, and it's not the first time the extreme left starts looking like the extreme right.
Scandinavia is just another socialist failure.
Sorry, reactionary leftist propaganda is boring.
I am both proud and happy to be Norwegian - a country many conservatives would call socialist
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"politicians"?
Yup, I think you pretty much nailed it. Or "economists" maybe.
Ruddy politicians.
Simpleton?
Oh really? Try dropping the corporate tax rate to 15% and see what happens.
There are many terms for those people, all accurate, none are nice
There is a term - it is "supply side economists."
Thought that would help.
Much older than that
They have one: socialists.
Matter of overestimating reach and power of laws or underestimating reach and (staying) power of economies ?
Yeah, super lazy talking point.
they also love to leave out the part where the US tried to stage a military coup that failed and enabled Chavez's initial crackdowns.
That’s a tangent- doesn’t bear on how the government has sabotaged the economy
The coup didn't cause inflation, but it did lead directly to a breakdown of the political system that is passing current policy.
a poor political system may not be able to pass laws to pull out of such an economic disaster, but they can clearly make it worse.
The US? Chavez forced that coup, it enabled him to take control on the oil and military. You give far too merit to the US.
Let me see that green card, Evans.
Actually right wing latam generals were authoritarians, and horrible in social terms, but most of them did advances in economics
Not one of your better tweets.
Germany has had ‘socialist’ governments. Somehow they didn’t produce this.
News to me (as a German). What governments are you referring to?
Strong effects of social outcomes in Germany affected by government, not purely markets. Hence, "socialist."
Can't say I agree. Germanys model of social market economy is based on social democracy and ordo/neoliberalism. Wouldn't call that socialist
Please explain the difference between socialism and social democracy. Most Americans don't see any and I would like another perspective.
One difference related to my prev tweet: To me SocDem is compatible with ordoliberalism to a degree (and vice versa) while socialism isn't.
Also, its not just americans, us venezuelans also blame it, and we know it in first hand.
What's the best piece you've read on the downfall of the Venezuelan economy/
Yep. To me it doesn't seem left or right had/have many ideas for diversifying beyond oil. Slide precedes Chavez.
Nothing socialist about a Junta in control of the economy, yes. Buying favors from violent underbelly nothing special, Saddam did that too.
Disgusting blue check marks get off my TL.
Venezuela is a failed state due to socialism.
Europe is a failure because of socialism.
Don’t be silly.
I'm deadly serious.
Socialism fails each and every time it's imposed on a nation.
The ultimate end game of socialism is starvation, secret police, gulags and mass murder.
To Europe yet...The European continent will take longer than a single country like Venezuela. Congrats on the slow miss